#42 - Kirsty: Escaping Abuse, Overcoming Addiction, Building Self-Worth & Paying Her Lived Experience Forward

Transcript

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This is a renewed original recording.

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Hello and welcome to the Believe in People podcast.

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My name is Matthew Butler and I am your host, or, as I like to say, your official sayer.

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Today I have with me Kersti.

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We explore unfit of contradiction and the challenges of navigating complex relationships.

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Kersti shares her experiences with subsist misuse and how it shaped her life, reflecting on her upbringing and family dynamics.

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Kersti courageously shares the weight of her previous relationships, shed the light and impacts of exploitation and multiple abusive partners who brought her to a rest and then reaching out for help.

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Kersti's narrative is punctuated by victories, including marking her six year sobriety milestone and embracing her role as a valued DWP peer mentor for the UK's leading third sector provider of drug and alcohol services, changegrow Live.

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Kersti, thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today.

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Can you tell me a little bit about yourself and what brings you to the chair?

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Well, I've just recently reached the six year mark for being abstinent.

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Congratulations.

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Thank you.

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So six years is a long time of abstinence obviously needs to be celebrated.

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What was your drug of choice?

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What was the one that you turned to the most?

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There was quite a few, but the main one was unfit of mean speed.

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How old was you when you first started taking unfit of mean?

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I think I started dabbling it, I guess, when I was about 16.

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That's quite a common time for people to start dabbling on fens.

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Did you do anything before then?

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Was you introduced to alcohol at an early age than that?

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I suppose I used to drink alcohol when I was younger.

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Yeah, then smoking a bit of weed.

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It does.

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I think at that age there's almost like this you're in this really experimental stage in life out here.

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So if I think about myself, I started with alcohol very young.

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I think I first started drinking with friends when I must have been about 13.

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And then with amphetamines.

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It's not something that I ever partook in, but I noticed a lot of my friends started to take it around that age of 15, 16 and that was that progression of let's try and take bigger risks.

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Was there any elements of peer pressure for you with amphetamines?

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Because I experienced that as a kid, the peer pressure to take amphetamines.

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I just obviously didn't start taking it myself, but did you experience that?

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I wouldn't so much say the peer pressure, but you try something, don't you?

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Yeah, you get a buzz from it, and then you just go on to try other stuff.

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What did you like about?

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it.

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What did I like about it?

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The buzz, the buzz, the way it just yeah, just the buzz it gave me.

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For someone who's never taken amphetamines.

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How would you describe the feeling of taking amphetamines to that person?

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You just feel high, you just feel you're active, you just make you busy At the time, you think you get stuff done but you don't actually get anything done.

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When did you realise that it had taken over for dependency?

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Because obviously, if you started taking this at 16, much older now than that when did you realise that you actually had a dependency to some?

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certain friends.

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I didn't really, sir, although I tried it when I was 16, I then went on to other stuff and there was other stuff that I was trying.

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I didn't actually bother that much with amphetamine till a little bit later on, probably about 18, 19, that's when I started using it.

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What was the other stuff after the amphetamines?

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So I was taking pills, those people that I knew I don't know if you've heard of, like damps, that and glue have I?

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obviously heard of glue, yet yeah, just try it.

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Actually, maybe I think someone else has mentioned that before.

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Yeah, just trying stuff like that and just whatever you could get a buzz out of.

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Tell me a little bit about, I suppose, family life and stuff growing up, Because as far as amphetamine, when we spoke in the past you seem to have quite a strong family background.

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Yeah, sir, I was brought up with.

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Both my parents come from a really nice home, nice big house.

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I've got seven brothers and sisters.

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Really nice home life.

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Dad always worked.

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My mum was a housewife.

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My parents was quite strict, always tea on the table at six o'clock.

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My dad had come in from work at six.

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Just, it was quite regimental and it had to be probably because there were so many of us.

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But yeah, we had a nice life, went on holidays so many times a year because we had like toro, caravan and stuff.

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Yeah, I'd say I had quite a nice life.

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So it's interesting, I think, the reason why I ask, a lot of people who go through substance misuse sometimes talk about adverse childhood experiences where their childhood was maybe quite traumatic and they found comfort in using substances later in life.

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But I think one of the things I always find interesting about your conversation is that you always talk really positively about your parents and about your home life, and so it's kind of, I guess, really it's interesting what brought on that substance misuse and that full seeking behaviour in your own personal life to want to do that?

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Did you maybe find that, being one of having seven brothers and sisters, did you feel like you maybe didn't, was acting out or anything?

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Where did it come from?

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I mean to be honest, when I was a kid, I always did feel like a little bit left out, although I wasn't.

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I just always felt like I was and I was not jealous of my brothers and sisters, but I always felt like they got more than what I did, Although they didn't and looking back now I know that they didn't but it was more probably because of the attention that I was obviously getting elsewhere, Because you're not the youngest, are you no?

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So you're kind of lost in the shuffle of the middle of those.

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Yes, I was the oldest girl but I was always like I was the one that was cheeky, I was the one that had been getting grounded all the time because I was just a bit of a pain.

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But no, I'd say it was more like the people that I was hanging around with and the people I was socialising and stuff with, because I was possibly not having healthy relationships and just not knowing what healthy friendships and healthy relationships were.

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Tell me a little bit more about what healthy relationships, or unhealthy relationships that you had.

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How well does it feel when you experience your first unhealthy relationship?

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I wouldn't even say it was a really.

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I mean, I started smoking when I was quite young and probably one of my earliest memories of smoking would be there was an older boy and he used to take me to somewhere quite near where I lived and he used to give me six in exchange for doing stuff.

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Sexual.

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Yeah, okay, so tell me a little bit more about that.

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How did that make you feel?

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Did that feel normal to you At the?

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time.

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Sexual favours for cigarettes and.

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I suppose at the time I didn't see it like that.

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It's only been since I've been clean that I've actually looked back at my life and Because I never understood where it came from, my parents would always say I don't understand why you're an addiction, you've had a nice life, why?

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And I didn't understand it.

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But it's only been, I'd say, since I've been clean, since I've been working, since I've been a professional, that I've actually looked back at my life and thought this is actually where it stemmed from.

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And yeah, probably being exploited, just being out and rebelling against having to be in a certain time and stuff, but yeah, just being exploited from quite a young age.

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I think one of the things that we've talked a lot about on this podcast is trauma and normalising trauma.

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And I think, when we have said this before, but when we experience something traumatic, we don't realise it's traumatic and so much later on when we look back and go hang on, that's not normal, that's not right and I think in your case, looking at what was happening there in terms of performing, you know, sexual favours for things like cigarettes, you're going to look back at that now and think, well, that's not right and if you normalise that, I have a feeling that that's going to be something that is.

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It was a reoccurring thing for you when you moved into substance misuse.

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Did you find that later on, in terms of your activity around substances, that you continued to perform sexual favours for drugs and more, I suppose, more expensive things?

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Yeah, I don't suppose it was even.

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It wasn't even just about drugs.

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Like you know, there was this, that boy that I'm talking about, who was older than me, and I can't even remember how old I was.

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I just know that I was that young that some of that sticks in my head is when, you know, I did, like, obviously, have my pants and stuff down that one of the comments that I'd made was well, you're not very hairy, are you?

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You know, you want, you haven't got many ears.

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And I look back now and I think, well, actually that's because I was a child and you know I was probably just starting puberty or whatever.

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But then, moving on from then, there was, you know, there was other people, there was, there was men, like when I was, I was underage, I was a child.

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And you look back now, don't you?

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And you realise that, then people you know, pedophiles, are being exploited.

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But I never saw it like that.

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I just, you know, it was just an unhealthy relationship.

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You know this.

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There was one particular guy who was a you know he was a lot, lot older than me.

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He was a fully grown man, you know, married, with kids and stuff, and you know I was, I was that young I used to have to be in half-past-eight on a night and he'd meet me and you know, we'd do stuff and it wasn't.

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It wasn't a healthy relationship and like at the time, like I loved this person, you know.

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So, feeling heartbroken, like at quite a young age, when you're not even old enough and you shouldn't even be in relationships like that, just led on to to more.

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I think that's one of the things that I've spoken about with, with my niece, who was who's 14 now and it's awful I reference to have these conversations, but you know, I don't I don't believe these conversations are necessary and I've said to her, like if, if you ever meet a boy who's older and they talk about you being mature for your age and stuff like that, I said you need to understand that you're likely there's an attempt at grooming there.

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Because that's what that's what groomers will do.

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They will take advantage of young girls by.

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And here's the thing when you, when I was young, if someone told me, oh, you're mature for your age, I take that as a massive compliment.

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Do you know?

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I think girls even more, so girls would probably take that even more as a compliment.

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Aside, you know you're really mature for your age because that's the thing.

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When you're a child, you think in a strange way, you always want to be older than you are until you're old enough.

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And then it's this paradoxical thing where you know teenage girls want to be older and then, when they're older, they're using products to make themselves look younger.

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Do you know what I mean?

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That's the paradox, but I was never like that.

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So when I was a kid, like I was a tomboy, I want I dressed like a boy, like I had short haircuts, you know, and I was quite a late developer, so I didn't really, I didn't even really have any like boobs until I was probably about I don't know 14, 15.

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Like I wasn't.

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It wasn't like I was.

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I was a young girl and I'd be wearing short skates or anything you know, even if I was, it wouldn't have mattered.

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But I want to dress like a boy.

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I didn't feel like you was advertising yourself to older people to you know for them to try and exploit or take it.

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Take it yeah.

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I would.

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I'd wear tracky bottoms, I'd wear trainers, I'd wear shorts, and you know I played football and all that kind of stuff.

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But I want I never put myself out there like wanting this male attention.

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I don't, I was vulnerable, wasn't I?

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I was going to say so from your point of view, why?

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Why do you think it happened then?

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Because, from what we've discussed as well, that you know, on and off this podcast and around exploitation, is that there was a pattern to it.

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And that you know you felt sometimes you was almost targeted because of it.

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Because, probably because I didn't know what a healthy relationship was and when when you feel that when you feel like someone, you feel like someone loves you, when you'll love them, even though actually you're looking back and it wasn't but you get.

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You get some kind of comfort from that dirty.

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When it makes you feel, makes you feel like you special, it makes you feel wanted.

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Yeah, I think that's always one of the things that I found most upsetting or distressing about.

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You know, abusive relationships and people are experiencing multiple abusive relationships is that if you start, or if you have a very early abusive relationship, then you could experience another abusive relationship after that, but because it's not as bad as the first one, you will somehow think that that is a healthy relationship.

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Or, you know, because you compare it to something that was much worse.

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But, then you talk to people, you talk to women about the relationships they've experienced, and it's I think it's heartbreaking that going back to the idea of normalizing behaviors and these relationships as things that are again normal, when, when they just aren't.

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And you know, you've said about this being kind of a pattern.

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How did it go then, from obviously being a young girl and experiencing exploitation into adulthood?

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because I know something that would discuses people and then in 10, 16, you know, Got my first like jobs and stuff like that and you know I left her.

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I left her because I thought I was older and at 16 as well.

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Yeah, it was yeah, and I can remember I'd started, I'd had a couple of little jobs which didn't really work out, but then I'd started this one particular job and I'd had gone home that day and said to my mom, and I'm, I'm going out of town to a party tonight, and she was like no, you know, said yeah, I am.

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No, you're not.

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Yeah, I am, I'm 16.

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I can do what I want.

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Hmm.

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Well, if that's what you think, then pack your bags and leave.

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Yeah, I packed my bag on the left.

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Yeah, and she wouldn't have meant that your mother I'm sure she didn't she just, you know, you've just called that bluff.

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I'm living my house and you follow my rules if you don't follow the rules.

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You know there's the dog.

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You know, see if you can be on your own.

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And you know like she'd say to me You're not an adult, you're 16.

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Hmm, um, but I did.

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I packed my bag.

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I'm a bag and I went.

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Where did you go live?

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I said either everywhere, um Mainly with men.

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Hmm mainly with older people.

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Yeah, and that's kind of where the drugs and the parties and all that kind of stuff Started again, it's the exploitation of a young girl at 16, left home and in a way You'll start to rely on these men in somewhere over that big, you know, financially or emotionally.

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Because one is the thing I think when people are older than you, you just naturally some that they're more mature than you or they can be more trusted than you because they've got, you know, age.

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On this side I mean now it's a little bit different.

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You know that, the age right now, but when you're a young person, you, when I was at 16, I thought people at 21, at the lights, all figured out.

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I thought by 21 my life would be sorted, you know.

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And it's ironic that now, at 32, I look back at 21.

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I think 21 you was, you was still a child, you know.

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I mean you hadn't really developed mentally between 16 to 21.

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I don't think I really developed mentally until I hit about 26, 27 and then some sort of sort of click to me.

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Well, I was a little bit more accountable for who I was and my actions and things out.

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But you do when you're younger, I think you rely on, on people who are older and and you just assume that they're gonna be more trustworthy, that they can have more knowledge or that they can help keep you safe and somewhere, and I think For a young girl as well, I imagine that that sort of thing is doubled as well, really.

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Yeah.

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I'm also so.

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Did you, did you settle down when many of these men did any of these relationships?

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The one, even really relationships.

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I, you know, looking back now I can see that I was just, I was just being exploited, and you know, by People that were higher up than me in like jobs and stuff like that you know they would.

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Yeah, they're just, I was, I was exploited and I eventually when you say exploited, do you mean sexually, emotionally?

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I was, just because I was vulnerable, like I'd just be get you know, I'd I'd be feeling, I'd be feeling sad because one person won't treat me very nice, or you know I was upset or whatever, and just yeah, I, just I, just the next, the next one had come along and it kind of you know, you know You're not being treated right, you don't deserve to be treated like this, let me.

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Let me treat you better.

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That's what we're saying.

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And if they treat you just a little bit better, you're thinking, you're something, thinking I've hit the lorry here this one's gonna be much better.

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This relationship is gonna be much better than the Mars, because it's just it's.

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All it takes is for that next relationship To just be a little bit better.

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And I think that's when you hear these stories about you know these these, you know domestic abusive relationships and things like that, and that's the part that I think, I think always upsets me in that sense.

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But when you, when you're staying with these people, are you paying rent or is there an exchange in there, if like?

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Because, you're having sex with them, they're paying bills and stuff like how did the workout?

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Because when you say about being exploited, obviously there is that generally you're younger, they're older, but but how?

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What was it that was being exploit?

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just parties, drugs, alcohol, sex, you know yeah exploited in that way and sometimes probably doing things that I didn't want to do.

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And then, yeah, I, yeah, just staying, staying from place to place.

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And then I moved.

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I moved in with a girl and I moved into a flat with another girl.

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Moves probably round about.

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I think she was round about my age, maybe a little bit older.

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Hmm, I moved into a flat with her.

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I mean years ago.

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It was really easy to get a flat one.

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He just approached her landlord and you know somebody, they just let you move in now.

00:18:36.045 --> 00:18:37.832
There's like credit checks and you know.

00:18:39.786 --> 00:18:42.092
And you know I'd lived in a few flats.

00:18:42.092 --> 00:18:48.314
I'd just I'd live there for so long, Not pay any rent you know, get evicted and just moving to the next one yeah.

00:18:51.747 --> 00:18:58.476
So when you say you was doing things that you didn't want to do, when you look back at that now as an adult, why was you doing them?

00:18:58.476 --> 00:19:03.250
Don't know You've ever thought about it, do you know?

00:19:03.250 --> 00:19:06.518
I've never really not wanted to think about, I guess is another thing.

00:19:07.705 --> 00:19:18.054
Probably because they showed me attention, you know, and I just, I thought at the time, I was thinking you know, I'm 16, I can do what I want, or I'm 17, I can do what I want.

00:19:18.054 --> 00:19:28.205
You know, at the time I'd say, I thought I was, I thought I was the one In control, I thought it was me getting what I wanted out them people it's.

00:19:28.205 --> 00:19:31.756
It's only now looking back that I realized that you know.

00:19:33.787 --> 00:19:48.794
There was taking advantage of me, yeah and that's what it seems to come down to, I think, really, for if you kind of Try and tie it on together, you know, being being a sort of middle child from a big family and that lack of attention, yeah, and now it's probably what it was, because I was quite needy as a child.

00:19:49.965 --> 00:19:52.050
Yeah, my mom and dad will tell you like I was.

00:19:52.050 --> 00:20:01.838
I was just needy, I was, I was quite ungrateful, I just, you know, it'd come to Christmas day and I'd look at everybody else's pile of presents and kind of say, like where's man is that?

00:20:01.838 --> 00:20:04.932
But I'd have the same as everyone else.

00:20:04.932 --> 00:20:07.505
It's just that I was getting older so I'd be getting smaller piles.

00:20:07.505 --> 00:20:08.729
You know I'd be getting jewelry.

00:20:08.729 --> 00:20:12.141
You know my younger siblings would be still getting the toys and yeah.

00:20:15.894 --> 00:20:18.401
You don't look at the monetary value when you get a little bit older.

00:20:18.401 --> 00:20:23.935
The pile then piles of toys and Presences you get all they get smaller, but they're probably cost more money as well.

00:20:25.769 --> 00:20:31.038
I was just ungrateful and I just thought, like you know, you care about everybody else more than they care about me.

00:20:31.038 --> 00:20:32.913
But that's just.

00:20:32.913 --> 00:20:34.163
That's just how I was as a child.

00:20:34.163 --> 00:20:35.450
And you know it.

00:20:35.450 --> 00:20:42.961
Maybe it was because there was a lot of us and was you know there was you know my mom and dad had had all of us to give their attention to, didn't they, sir?

00:20:42.961 --> 00:20:50.086
Maybe that's why I acted out quite a lot and, you know, always in trouble at school and yeah.

00:20:50.288 --> 00:20:52.035
I just I, just I just thought.

00:20:52.035 --> 00:20:54.744
I just thought I want as loved as everyone else.

00:20:54.744 --> 00:20:56.692
Yeah but I was.

00:20:56.692 --> 00:21:03.265
It was just I want getting attention, that I probably needed, yeah, at the time when it must be hard as well.

00:21:03.305 --> 00:21:03.625
Do you know?

00:21:03.625 --> 00:21:22.085
So I think, for even look at this as from a parent perspective, you know, when you've got a big family, because there is that element of and it's like you know, see where I feel like I'm doing multiple jobs at the moment, I'm giving a hundred percent to four different jobs, which means you only given 25 percent to each each role, really, and it's it's similar with kids.

00:21:22.085 --> 00:21:23.410
You've got four children.

00:21:23.410 --> 00:21:24.773
You give a hundred percent.

00:21:24.773 --> 00:21:27.491
Are you really only giving 25 percent to each kid?

00:21:27.511 --> 00:21:29.396
Yeah, do you know I mean it's that hundred percent.

00:21:29.396 --> 00:21:37.859
It has to be split somewhere doesn't it now, because I'm a mum yeah, yeah so you know you do love your kids all the same, don't you just that you know.

00:21:37.859 --> 00:21:42.053
Every one of them is different, so the attention that you give each child is different to the next child.

00:21:42.354 --> 00:21:43.457
How old was you when you became a mum?

00:21:44.807 --> 00:21:45.250
I was.

00:21:45.250 --> 00:21:53.851
I came a mum in 2001, so I was a Mumfuff being 21, so I was quite young.

00:21:54.152 --> 00:21:56.277
I was still in primary school in 2001.

00:21:56.277 --> 00:21:57.867
Yeah, I feel like that.

00:21:57.867 --> 00:22:00.731
But, that's, that's young.

00:22:00.731 --> 00:22:12.719
That's still young to be having to know, obviously, your first child I tell me a little bit about, because you know still that's it's not far off the edge of still going through all this, that you're going through the substance, misuse, that party lifestyle.

00:22:12.719 --> 00:22:16.496
Tell me a little bit about the circumstances around again.

00:22:17.605 --> 00:22:38.573
Somebody I met, somebody I met at work what older than me and and in fact I'll say this like I'd had sex with his brother, and then I can always remember he'd said to me at work, my brother's had you know, so it's Martin kind of thing, yeah, and I did how did that make you feel when he said that?

00:22:38.573 --> 00:22:47.990
At the time, I don't know probably Wanted special.

00:22:47.990 --> 00:22:49.474
You know I was young.

00:22:49.474 --> 00:22:52.545
That's what I mean, because I think it was all day when you say that it sounds.

00:22:53.207 --> 00:22:53.989
That sounds awful.

00:22:53.989 --> 00:22:56.876
My brother's had, you know, it's my turn that and it sounds awful.

00:22:56.876 --> 00:23:09.711
But there's something about basic what we're talking about so far, which I felt like you would have taken that as a compliment, as being wanted and maybe even enjoying a comment like that being passed your way, yeah, which to me obviously that sounds awful.

00:23:09.711 --> 00:23:16.337
But I think for you and what you've gone for at this point, that's normal behavior, that's a normal way to speak, to do you know?

00:23:16.598 --> 00:23:21.751
20 year old Kesty or whatever you was, it was yeah, how does that make you feel, though?

00:23:21.771 --> 00:23:30.832
when you think about that, and the way you was spoken to about then and the way you Just try as a bit, of, a bit of an object, almost you know what I mean and that's what it, that's what it sounds like.

00:23:32.286 --> 00:23:42.797
Looking back now like yeah, made me feel shit, hmm, made me feel shit, but I can't, you know, I can't change that, I can't do anything about it?

00:23:42.797 --> 00:23:48.202
Again, it was, it was the lifestyle, it was, it was the drugs, it was.

00:23:48.202 --> 00:23:51.173
You know Some, it was all there.

00:23:51.173 --> 00:23:51.835
We had a car.

00:23:51.835 --> 00:23:55.971
Yeah, it just just was one of them.

00:23:55.971 --> 00:23:56.653
So how?

00:23:56.692 --> 00:23:58.597
did that relationship go then obviously you had a.

00:23:58.597 --> 00:24:05.198
Yeah, you're a child person how to tell me a little bit about how it was very abusive.

00:24:06.885 --> 00:24:11.116
There was a lot of domestic abuse involved and a lot of drug abuse.

00:24:12.486 --> 00:24:13.490
From both of you.

00:24:13.490 --> 00:24:13.891
Was that?

00:24:13.891 --> 00:24:14.594
What was it?

00:24:15.630 --> 00:24:28.308
I'd say so, yeah, but Me being me being 18 and being 10 years older, and you know the way it progressed as it did, you know he shouldn't have.

00:24:28.308 --> 00:24:42.977
He shouldn't have been treating me the way that he was treating me and Really, really highly abusive, would put me down, would bodyshape me and Would come into the place where I worked.

00:24:42.977 --> 00:24:44.265
He would spit in my face.

00:24:44.265 --> 00:24:55.067
It would spit in my face in front of my younger brothers and sisters to the point where my mum and dad stopped my younger siblings coming to my house because they didn't want them around that.

00:24:55.067 --> 00:24:58.936
But for a long time, like I hid that from, I hid that from my parents.

00:24:58.977 --> 00:25:08.851
He had it from my family, but then it just got to a point where you know I couldn't add it anymore and you know People were seeing it, neighbors were seeing it.

00:25:08.851 --> 00:25:22.111
No, like nobody ever reported things, people saw things, people had things and you know the fact that he was, he was coming into my place of work and stuff and you know spitting in my face and stuff like that.

00:25:22.111 --> 00:25:25.959
Like not nobody ever, not one person ever, reported anything.

00:25:26.945 --> 00:25:27.909
There's something about that as well.

00:25:27.909 --> 00:25:32.424
If you think about even how we've progressed, is just a society in the last 20 years?

00:25:32.424 --> 00:25:40.432
I mean, you got used that the toilet and, as during this, opposed to like if you feel Unsafe, you know, speak to someone can help you, and things like this.

00:25:40.432 --> 00:25:42.056
There's loads of things around that now.

00:25:42.076 --> 00:25:44.727
I didn't know anything about Domestic use.

00:25:44.727 --> 00:25:49.826
You know, even like growing up and stuff like that, I know like being exploited, there was nothing.

00:25:49.826 --> 00:25:51.392
There was nothing on social media.

00:25:51.392 --> 00:26:05.673
You know we didn't get them talks from our parents about Healthy relationships and being exploited or being used by men and you know your body's your own and you know Don't let anybody come near you and stuff it won't.

00:26:05.673 --> 00:26:09.311
We was just told like Beware of the man down the street.

00:26:09.311 --> 00:26:10.778
You know the we had all looking one at.

00:26:10.857 --> 00:26:18.625
you know that was probably quite innocent, and you know the incomparison to what we just got warned of you know strange, you danger.

00:26:18.684 --> 00:26:23.275
I don't speak to strangers that speak to them because there could be you know the bad man and stuff.

00:26:23.275 --> 00:26:24.778
I won't never warned about.

00:26:24.778 --> 00:26:30.059
Things like that I won't talk to about, even like domestic abuse and stuff like I didn't.

00:26:30.059 --> 00:26:31.545
I didn't know what domestic abuse was.

00:26:31.545 --> 00:26:33.891
I'd never been brought up around my parents.

00:26:33.891 --> 00:26:36.356
I'd never, never read my parents argue, never.

00:26:36.356 --> 00:26:38.970
They kept evict the shelters from all that.

00:26:38.970 --> 00:26:42.538
If they obviously did, because you know they'd have had the struggles and stuff.

00:26:42.538 --> 00:26:45.474
But I was just never subjected to anything like that growing up.

00:26:46.126 --> 00:26:48.796
You know it was so was it like to be on the receiving end of it then?

00:26:48.796 --> 00:26:51.645
Because you can, you know, yes, now we're.

00:26:51.645 --> 00:27:08.778
There's a lot more messages out there around healthy relationships and what healthy relationship should look like, but back then, the only thing you can really model what is a healthy relationship or what isn't a healthy relationship Is your parents, like you know, and their relationships and kind of thinking well, you know, my mum and dad are like this, so that's what a normal relationship looks like.

00:27:08.778 --> 00:27:09.545
That's kind of what we do.

00:27:09.545 --> 00:27:15.105
So what was it like to be on the receiving end of something which, by the sounds of it, is a complete polar opposite to what your parents was?

00:27:15.726 --> 00:27:16.188
I hid it.

00:27:16.428 --> 00:27:19.055
Hmm, why did you hide it Was it was?

00:27:19.055 --> 00:27:22.261
Did you just know it was wrong and you did you feel ashamed about it?

00:27:22.261 --> 00:27:23.852
What was the reason for hiding it?

00:27:24.153 --> 00:27:34.888
I suppose because growing up I always, I Always imagined like you grow up, you meet someone, you get, you know, you have kids and you get married and you have this happy ever after.

00:27:34.888 --> 00:27:44.152
So I suppose I wanted I wanted people to think that that's what I had, because I felt ashamed that I didn't have that so I hid it for a long time.

00:27:44.393 --> 00:27:46.891
Hmm, how long did that relationship last?

00:27:48.365 --> 00:27:49.349
Seven and a half years.

00:27:49.349 --> 00:27:53.015
Yeah, and it was you know.

00:27:54.106 --> 00:27:54.468
How do you?

00:27:54.468 --> 00:28:05.359
How, because for someone who's been so openly abusive in front of family and it's going to your place of work and be abusive, I Drift, I think, how, like, what was that like for your child?

00:28:05.359 --> 00:28:09.494
I Mean like, how did you, you know, protect or shield them from it?

00:28:09.494 --> 00:28:12.351
Could you even protect or shield them?

00:28:12.392 --> 00:28:13.474
probably, probably not.

00:28:13.474 --> 00:28:15.492
No, I mean, there was, there was.

00:28:15.492 --> 00:28:16.678
There was quite young.

00:28:16.678 --> 00:28:21.536
When we split up, I think my youngest was four and the eldest was five.

00:28:21.536 --> 00:28:25.715
And no, I didn't, I didn't shield them from it.

00:28:25.715 --> 00:28:27.364
I didn't know how to shield them from it.

00:28:27.364 --> 00:28:31.451
I was, I just I just used.

00:28:31.451 --> 00:28:34.356
You know, we had a huge drugs motor function.

00:28:34.678 --> 00:28:34.857
Hmm.

00:28:35.077 --> 00:28:35.980
That's, that's all I did.

00:28:35.980 --> 00:28:39.007
Yeah, I didn't, I Couldn't.

00:28:39.007 --> 00:28:40.413
I just couldn't get by.

00:28:40.413 --> 00:28:44.448
I just couldn't get by every day without without using it's.

00:28:44.448 --> 00:28:48.397
I just used every day and just got on with it and functioned almost like a robot.

00:28:48.397 --> 00:28:52.036
You know, and the way it was at home.

00:28:52.036 --> 00:28:55.675
The more I was I would put into work, the more I would be at work.

00:28:57.385 --> 00:28:58.489
Was there an element of?

00:28:58.489 --> 00:29:04.105
I mean, I guess well, firstly was, you would have had these conversations with your children by now.

00:29:04.105 --> 00:29:12.102
I'm sure you know they're not that much older, but have they said anything about what it was like for them as children growing up in that house, where that was happening?

00:29:12.122 --> 00:29:20.269
I Mean, that's kind of their trauma and I'm not a lot, you know it's, that's not my story to tell, but yeah, there's.

00:29:20.630 --> 00:29:21.694
There's been aware of it.

00:29:21.694 --> 00:29:24.105
They were, there was, it was, they were at the time.

00:29:24.645 --> 00:29:25.407
Yeah, yeah they've.

00:29:25.407 --> 00:29:27.853
They were subjected to that trauma too.

00:29:28.093 --> 00:29:36.233
Okay, yeah, there was so, being in domestically abusive relationship, being in addiction, and what was that like for you?

00:29:37.186 --> 00:29:59.384
It was horrendous, it was horrible and you know, if my whole life was a mess and my mental health was Like really bad, like I just lost all my confidence and I just I just literally cry on a daily basis and didn't have any confidence to just felt worthless, and I suppose some of that probably comes from while I was with him.

00:29:59.384 --> 00:30:17.450
Um it, you know it be, telling me that I was sleeping with my friends and it refer to my friends as fit and just stupid things like Women being on the TV like physically made me feel sick because of the fact he used to be saying, you know, you know, look at the tits on air.

00:30:17.450 --> 00:30:19.536
And just just being like vulgar about them.

00:30:19.644 --> 00:30:21.816
I was done to show like it is what you're, not his.

00:30:21.816 --> 00:30:32.513
Do you know your friends are more attractive, yeah yeah it's doing a way to really manipulate you, isn't it, and make you feel much, much less Wavy of you own self-love and care, I guess.

00:30:32.795 --> 00:30:32.996
Yeah.

00:30:32.996 --> 00:30:35.644
So you know, I stopped, I isolated myself.

00:30:35.644 --> 00:30:45.018
I stopped my friends coming around and even just like Watching the TV and stuff, like if somebody was good looking on TV I would literally just feel physically sick.

00:30:45.018 --> 00:31:04.114
Yeah, and that was it whilst whilst I was with him, but then also going on to like a new relationship that just stayed with me like I couldn't, you know I'd cause an argument just because we'd be sat watching something on the TV and somebody nice had been on the TV or Would you know, would we'd be at the shops or whatever.

00:31:04.114 --> 00:31:04.586
Do I?

00:31:04.586 --> 00:31:12.618
Just being in a car and passing somebody that was nice and Seeing my partner look like I'd just be just physically make me feel sick and that that's.

00:31:12.719 --> 00:31:13.843
I think that's the thing, isn't it?

00:31:13.843 --> 00:31:18.964
When we talk about like Well, like social media and everything today, people constantly comparing themselves.

00:31:18.964 --> 00:31:26.250
I honestly think comparing yourself to others is the one thing that leads to really low mental health, whether that be on social media.

00:31:26.250 --> 00:31:33.452
When you scroll through Instagram, you've seen the life that other people have and Doing that constantly, not even on social media, but in real life.

00:31:33.492 --> 00:31:39.105
That's something that I imagine really Affected you long term it did because I just I didn't want to go out.

00:31:39.105 --> 00:31:46.199
You know there'd be there'd be like social situations where I want to go just for that fear of other people looking nice.

00:31:46.986 --> 00:31:49.186
Comparing yourself, yeah sounds.

00:31:49.307 --> 00:31:50.652
Sounds like really sad now, don't it?

00:31:50.652 --> 00:31:51.314
But it does.

00:31:51.314 --> 00:32:01.994
And Because he always told me that I was fat and stuff, like I just felt physically like disgusted with myself all the time, which, you know, taking speed does make you lose weight, don't it?

00:32:01.994 --> 00:32:03.428
And but I would.

00:32:03.428 --> 00:32:19.659
I was taking it to the point where I was that thin like just getting a bath, like it hurt me because you know, like you cox it, you burn on your own yeah yeah, yeah, it on the bottom of the bathroom stuff when I was in the bath, because I was that thin and but I just saw myself as fat.

00:32:20.766 --> 00:32:21.327
Did that lead to?

00:32:21.327 --> 00:32:23.474
Any is only eating disorders as well with yourself.

00:32:23.474 --> 00:32:24.147
Do you know?

00:32:24.147 --> 00:32:25.011
Was you making which?

00:32:25.051 --> 00:32:25.554
make this off.

00:32:25.554 --> 00:32:26.278
I didn't eat.

00:32:26.278 --> 00:32:27.865
No, I just didn't eat.

00:32:27.865 --> 00:32:32.897
If I, if I was hungry, I'd just I just eat more speed.

00:32:33.806 --> 00:32:42.933
Eat more speed to stop me wanting to replace and replacing food with with amphetamines and yeah you know, the more out, the more I was in addiction and stuff, obviously the more dead.

00:32:42.953 --> 00:32:49.702
And that I got in Like, yeah, the more, the more I was using, the more I couldn't afford it, the more I was.

00:32:49.702 --> 00:33:03.530
You know, just, my deck was spiraling, I wouldn't open my mail, you know, and then just having like bail if sat the door and stuff like that, and then started like using like doorstep lenders and stuff and yeah, just got in a mess with all that.

00:33:03.691 --> 00:33:04.734
That's it, it's the em.

00:33:04.734 --> 00:33:07.709
So quickly it can spiral, isn't it?

00:33:07.709 --> 00:33:08.349
I suppose?

00:33:08.349 --> 00:33:13.038
And I was talking about like tackling stigma and trying to kind of put yourself in other people's position.

00:33:13.038 --> 00:33:18.799
One of my colleagues said to me before said you're only two miss paychecks away from being homeless, and that always resonated with me.

00:33:18.799 --> 00:33:24.595
I thought, you know, it's probably right, if I didn't pay my mortgage for the next two months, if I didn't pay my bills over up next two months, I probably would end up homeless.

00:33:24.595 --> 00:33:30.357
And you realize the gap between you and people like our street homes that are often ignored.

00:33:30.357 --> 00:33:33.164
It's a very small gap, yet in our mind.

00:33:33.164 --> 00:33:39.849
We probably like to compare ourselves more to having more in common with the likes of millionaires and these Celebrities that we see on social media.

00:33:39.849 --> 00:33:41.032
When it's not the case.

00:33:41.032 --> 00:33:42.236
We do have more in common.

00:33:45.666 --> 00:33:46.951
I'd been threatened with eviction.

00:33:46.951 --> 00:33:50.325
You know, from my council property and stuff, because I just want won't pay you.

00:33:50.345 --> 00:33:51.148
I won't pay my rent.

00:33:51.148 --> 00:33:53.721
Just moving on to the next one, as you said, you don't you know I?

00:33:53.740 --> 00:33:53.882
did.

00:33:53.882 --> 00:33:54.545
I did that.

00:33:54.545 --> 00:34:00.567
But then when I had a council house and I was on my own with the kids and stuff like it's a bit different.

00:34:00.586 --> 00:34:02.491
When you've got kids in, I suppose you can't be stopped on.

00:34:02.511 --> 00:34:13.869
Leave as easy as you used to moving, go live somewhere else, but then obviously when I had a family Like it, yeah, changes, everything doesn't yeah the thought of like being kicked out and stuff Won't nice.

00:34:13.869 --> 00:34:23.289
But you know, luckily I had my family who'd bail me out and but yeah, just yeah, it was just, it was just not nice one, nice at all.

00:34:24.130 --> 00:34:35.590
If you think of all these these years of abuse of substance, misuse of, you know, physical abuse, sexual abuse, what what would you consider now, on reflection, to be that rock bottom moment?

00:34:35.590 --> 00:34:40.262
What was the worst moment of it where you thought, right, I need to, I need to make some changes?

00:34:42.052 --> 00:34:44.239
That was probably years and years later.

00:34:44.239 --> 00:34:47.755
Yeah, just, I had.

00:34:47.755 --> 00:34:56.302
I had my children removed for six weeks and I got placed on my parents, mm-hmm, and luckily, you know, I've had, I had a supportive family.

00:34:56.302 --> 00:35:00.260
They'd been an incident at my house.

00:35:00.260 --> 00:35:07.713

#42 - Kirsty: Escaping Abuse, Overcoming Addiction, Building Self-Worth & Paying Her Lived Experience Forward

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